The Origins of Sin

[Rose]

The concept of sin originates in the biblical story of Adam and Eve and sets the stage from which the rest of the Bible draws its need for salvation, or redemption. This sin idea that has adversly affected the lives of billions of people throughout history lies at the heart of Judaism, Christianity, and Islam; all tracing their roots back to a mythical story of a talking snake in the Garden. When one takes a serious look at the story from which this concept of sin arose, it is quite unbelievable to say the least.

The story begins in chapter two of Genesis with the formation of the man called Adam from a lump of clay. Now, this in and of itself is the least offensive to a thinking person’s senses, because conceivably a creator god could form life from inorganic material, but what follows is beyond belief. After God created this man called Adam, he made a beautiful garden as a place for him to live, replete with animals and trees for food (except for one bad tree), but forgot to create a mate for him…oops. To solve this oversight of the missing mate, God instructed Adam to search through all the animals that were in the garden for a suitable helper and while he was at it to give the animals names. Well, as we expected nary a helper was to be found…poor Adam, he must have been quite discouraged by the time he finished naming the last critter, but never fear…God to the rescue. God in all his omnipotence caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam (he was probably tired from naming all those animals), and as he was slumbering took one of his ribs to form a helpmate for him (no lump of clay this time) that was part of his flesh. Sort of like the way a child comes from the mothers flesh, but this time instead of life coming from the female it was taken from the male (I guess God likes variety). Now, finally Adam had a mate, but apparently he didn’t inform her properly about the one tree in the entire garden that they weren’t supposed to eat from. Mind you this tree was a magical tree, not only for looks and food, but also for wisdom…and as you might expect the woman wanted wisdom. So, who do you suppose appears on the scene…a talking snake of course! This wasn’t just any old talking snake, he was the most subtle of every creature that God had made, and he knew all about the tree of wisdom in the garden. It’s not to hard to guess what happens next…the talking snake temps the girl to eat from that bad tree that will make her wise. As any parent knows one doesn’t tell their children not to eat something that is delicious and then put it right in front of them along with a tempter to entice them, but then God isn’t like a normal parent. Anyway, Eve eats of the delicious fruit offered to her by the talking snake, sharing some with Adam, and thus for all eternity introduces the concept of sin into the human picture…and gets their asses kicked out of the garden for good!

Now, we could blame Eve, or Adam, but I think the blame must be placed solely on the shoulders of Yahweh…that is if you believe in him, but if you don’t then sin has no place in your belief system either, and that means you are one of the lucky ones who didn’t get indoctrinated with the idea of sin that started with a mythological talking snake in a garden.


Rose

[heb13-13]

The concept of sin originates in the biblical story of Adam and Eve and sets the stage from which the rest of the Bible draws its need for salvation, or redemption. This sin idea that has adversly affected the lives of billions of people throughout history lies at the heart of Judaism, Christianity, and Islam; all tracing their roots back to a mythical story of a talking snake in the Garden. When one takes a serious look at the story from which this concept of sin arose, it is quite unbelievable to say the least.

The story begins in chapter two of Genesis with the formation of the man called Adam from a lump of clay. Now, this in and of itself is the least offensive to a thinking person’s senses, because conceivably a creator god could form life from inorganic material, but what follows is beyond belief. After God created this man called Adam, he made a beautiful garden as a place for him to live, replete with animals and trees for food (except for one bad tree), but forgot to create a mate for him…oops.

I must have missed that. Where does it show that God forgot to create a mate? I think He wanted His narrative to show that Adam needed a mate and that He knew it. Adam needed a mate that was bone of his bones and flesh of his flesh. Gen 2:18 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.


To solve this oversight of the missing mate, God instructed Adam to search through all the animals that were in the garden for a suitable helper and while he was at it to give the animals names. Well, as we expected nary a helper was to be found…poor Adam, he must have been quite discouraged by the time he finished naming the last critter, but never fear…God to the rescue.

Ha!! I knew you were capable of recognizing truth. Yes, God to the rescue. He knows about relationships.


God in all his omnipotence caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam (he was probably tired from naming all those animals), and as he was slumbering took one of his ribs to form a helpmate for him (no lump of clay this time) that was part of his flesh.

I don't think you are going to take someone's rib while they are awake (think anesthesia). However, naming all those animals would make me tired, too.


Sort of like the way a child comes from the mothers flesh, but this time instead of life coming from the female it was taken from the male (I guess God likes variety).

Actually, Adam did not make the female, but his rib was the starting place or substance she was made from (think bone marrow, DNA, etc). God made her. Gen 2:22 "And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he (God) a woman", and brought her unto the man. God made her and presented her to man just like God is going to present a Bride to Christ.


Now, finally Adam had a mate, but apparently he didn’t inform her properly about the one tree in the entire garden that they weren’t supposed to eat from.
Where does it say that Adam did not inform her?


Mind you this tree was a magical tree, not only for looks and food, but also for wisdom…and as you might expect the woman wanted wisdom. So, who do you suppose appears on the scene…a talking snake of course! This wasn’t just any old talking snake, he was the most subtle of every creature that God had made, and he knew all about the tree of wisdom in the garden. It’s not too hard to guess what happens next…the talking snake temps the girl to eat from that bad tree that will make her wise. As any parent knows one doesn’t tell their children not to eat something that is delicious and then put it right in front of them along with a tempter to entice them, but then God isn’t like a normal parent. Anyway, Eve eats of the delicious fruit offered to her by the talking snake, sharing some with Adam, and thus for all eternity introduces the concept of sin into the human picture…and gets their asses kicked out of the garden for good!

I dont't know what's wrong with you people. What is so hard to believe about that?


Now, we could blame Eve, or Adam, but I think the blame must be placed solely on the shoulders of Yahweh…that is if you believe in him, but if you don’t then sin has no place in your belief system either, and that means you are one of the lucky ones who didn’t get indoctrinated with the idea of sin that started with a mythological talking snake in a garden.

Rose

Have your children ever disobeyed you. It was probably your fault, right? You might have had something good in the house that you did not want them to partake of and then they did anyway. You probably blamed yourself. You thought, "I should not have anything good and tempting in my house. That's not fair to my children. Anything, my kids want they can have anytime they want. Then there will never be disobedience, because I won't hold them to any rules." And your kids grew up to be the most fantastic and wonderful adults that ever lived, because they were taught that nothing is off limits. Wow. God really is bad parent and unfair, too.

Unfortunately, your agenda is so bent on defaming the God of the Bible that you don't see your own foolish reasoning.

Of course you are able to get some traction too, because whatever you don't believe, (Satan, Sin, etc) you discount and cut it out of the equation (Bible). And you don't see the big picture... what God is ultimately after... not sure if you ever did.

What were you after in regards to your children, when you were raising them?

I am believing and praying that the Lord will make Himself known to you in an unmistakeable way.

Rick

[CWH]

Great post Rick!:thumb:

Obviously, RAM and Rose are trying to make us atheists and non-theists with their God bashing. Fat Hopes!

Let me counteract Rose using her own false logic:

The story begins in chapter two of Genesis with the formation of the man called Adam from a lump of clay. Now, this in and of itself is the least offensive to a thinking person’s senses, because conceivably a creator god could form life from inorganic material. It's like a robot maker making robots with ability to make free-will decisions. After God created this man called Adam, he made a beautiful garden as a place for him to live, replete with animals and trees for food (except for one bad tree). He tested to see if His robot could cope with working and tending the Garden himself and found that he couldn't To solve this problem, he needs a helping mate, God instructed Adam to search through all the animals that were in the garden for a suitable helper and while he was at it to give the animals names. Well, as we expected nary a helper was to be found…poor Adam, he must have been quite discouraged by the time he finished naming the last critter, but never fear…God to the rescue. God in all his omnipotence caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam (he was probably tired from naming all those animals), and as he was slumbering took one of his ribs to form a helpmate for him (no lump of clay this time, the reason is that it is much easier and accurate-wise to self-generate another robot than to make another out of scratch) that was part of his flesh. Sort of like the way a child comes from the mothers flesh, but this time instead of life coming from the female it was taken from the male (I guess God likes variety). Now, finally Adam had a mate, but apparently God tested his newly created robots(with free will to make decisions) about obedience and told them of the one tree in the entire garden that they weren’t supposed to eat from. Mind you this tree was a "Tester machine", not only for looks and food, but also for wisdom…and as you might expect the woman wanted wisdom. Another "Tester machine" of a talking snake of course was made to test if His robots would not only obey or disobey Him and if they are more skewed towards doing good or towards doing evil! This wasn’t just any old talking snake, he was the most subtle of every creature that God had made, and he knew all about the tree of wisdom in the garden. It’s not to hard to guess what happens next…the talking snake temps the girl to eat from that bad tree that will make her wise. As any parent knows that to test their children regarding obedience and to see if they are naughty or not is to tell them not to eat something that is delicious and then put it right in front of them along with a tempter to entice them. Anyway, Eve eats of the delicious fruit offered to her by the talking snake, sharing some with Adam, and thus for all eternity introduces the concept of sin into the human picture… the verdict was thus known and the test completed that they were disobedient to commands and skewed towards doing evil and thus have no right to live in a "good, holy, righteous and orderly" environment in the Garden and they will then need to gets their asses kicked out of the garden for good. But as good and just parents, they meted the punishment for the children's disobedience, evilness and naughtiness with the promise that after sometime when they have learned that being disobedient, evil and naughty will not do them much good and when they have truly repented and become good, righteous and obedient, they would have matured in their thinking and development of what is like "being as wise as God knowing good and evil", He would accept them back into the Garden which is now termed and turned into the Kingdom of Heaven.

Now, we could blame Eve, or Adam, but I think No blame must be placed solely on the shoulders of Yahweh who was just doing His job to ensure that His products which are robots (with free will self making decision) are of a very high standard quality capable of operating in an excellent, non-evil, holy and righteous environment known as the Kingdom of Heaven.

Thak God for His wisdom in creating Adam and Eve. :pray:

[Rose]

Have your children ever disobeyed you. It was probably your fault, right? You might have had something good in the house that you did not want them to partake of and then they did anyway. You probably blamed yourself. You thought, "I should not have anything good and tempting in my house. That's not fair to my children. Anything, my kids want they can have anytime they want. Then there will never be disobedience, because I won't hold them to any rules." And your kids grew up to be the most fantastic and wonderful adults that ever lived, because they were taught that nothing is off limits. Wow. God really is bad parent and unfair, too.

Unfortunately, your agenda is so bent on defaming the God of the Bible that you don't see your own foolish reasoning.

Hi Rick, :yo:
It seems to me you're the one with the foolish reasoning. As long as you remain locked inside your Christian box and deny reality you will never see the truth. The main point of my post was to show where this whole idea of sin originated from, which is a mythological garden story with a talking snake. If you want to blame someone for defaming God, blame the authors of Scripture who have presented their God to be a two-faced moral monster.


Of course you are able to get some traction too, because whatever you don't believe, (Satan, Sin, etc) you discount and cut it out of the equation (Bible). And you don't see the big picture... what God is ultimately after... not sure if you ever did.

What were you after in regards to your children, when you were raising them?

I am believing and praying that the Lord will make Himself known to you in an unmistakeable way.

Rick

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to do a little bragging. :signthankspin: I have two boys, ages 16 and 19, and I could not ask for two better children, they are kind, caring people who have never given me any problems. What I was after in regards to raising them was to impart a sense of treating all people with kindness and equality no matter what their gender, race or religious belief is...and I'm happy to say I succeeded, without ever having to beat them with a rod. :eek:

All the best,
Rose

[heb13-13]

Hi Rick, :yo:
Thank you for giving me the opportunity to do a little bragging. :signthankspin: I have two boys, ages 16 and 19, and I could not ask for two better children, they are kind, caring people who have never given me any problems. What I was after in regards to raising them was to impart a sense of treating all people with kindness and equality no matter what their gender, race or religious belief is...and I'm happy to say I succeeded, without ever having to beat them with a rod. :eek:

All the best,
Rose

That's wonderful that you have fine boys and have never had to "beat" them. Did you ever have to tell them no, or discipline them. Did they ever disobey you? What were the consequences to them?

Rick

[Rose]

That's wonderful that you have fine boys and have never had to "beat" them. Did you ever have to tell them no, or discipline them. Did they ever disobey you? What were the consequences to them?

Rick

Of course I've had to tell them no, but I can assure you if there was punishment it always fit the "crime". I have never tempted them, unlike the biblical example where God not only tempts Adam and Eve with a fruit that is to be desired for its taste and wisdom (good things), but also allows one of his own creations to entice them with the fruits good qualities...and then curses them and sentences them to death for eating it. How pathetic is that?

Good thing it's all a myth :D

Rose

[heb13-13]

Of course I've had to tell them no, but I can assure you if there was punishment it always fit the "crime". I have never tempted them, unlike the biblical example where God not only tempts Adam and Eve with a fruit that is to be desired for its taste and wisdom (good things), but also allows one of his own creations to entice them with the fruits good qualities...and then curses them and sentences them to death for eating it. How pathetic is that?

Good thing it's all a myth :D

Rose

Rose,

When you were a Christian, how did you handle God's discipline?

Rick

[Richard Amiel McGough]

Rose,

When you were a Christian, how did you handle God's discipline?

Rick
As a Christian, how do you discern between random chance, your imagination, Satan's attacks, and God's discipline?

[Rose]

Rose,

When you were a Christian, how did you handle God's discipline?

Rick
Hey Rick,

When I was a Christian my intuition always trumped the Bible, if the Bible went against what I thought was right. I never believed that crap about sparing the rod and spoiling the child, I always thought it was child abuse!

Rose

[heb13-13]

Hey Rick,

When I was a Christian my intuition always trumped the Bible, if the Bible went against what I thought was right. I never believed that crap about sparing the rod and spoiling the child, I always thought it was child abuse!

Rose

But, that is not what I am talking about. How did you handle God's correction of you? Did you ever experience His chastisement by His Spirit.

Rick

[CWH]

Hey Rick,

When I was a Christian my intuition always trumped the Bible, if the Bible went against what I thought was right. I never believed that crap about sparing the rod and spoiling the child, I always thought it was child abuse!

Rose

Is sparing the rod the best method? If so why did the law of the land use the rod to punish criminals? If sparing the rod is so good why not use it on every child? What I am saying is, every child is different, you cannot use the same method on every child. If sparing the rod doesn't work, Use the rod! Sparing the rod will not work on most criminals, not to say the hard core or incorrigible ones. Hit the criminal very hard and sent the message that crime doesn't pay and make criminals fear are the best methods to reduce crimes. That was what God was doing.

May God punish all evildoers hard.:pray:

[Rose]

But, that is not what I am talking about. How did you handle God's correction of you? Did you ever experience His chastisement by His Spirit.

Rick

What do you mean God's correction? How is a person supposed to tell the difference between having regrets for doing something that you wished you hadn't, and what you call chastisement by His Spirt? Before I was a Christian, during the time I was a Christian and after I left the Christian faith I have experience twinges of conscience, but I never considered that to be any more than my own sense of right and wrong speaking to me.

Rose